Let's Just Shut Up About Pace of Play on Tour
by One-Eyed Golfer Guy on Mar 5, 2010 7:11 AM EST
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Read the following sentences very slowly. Slow play can be fixed. Slow play can be fixed. Slow play will not be fixed. Slow play will not be fixed.
John Feinstein reported yesterday on The Golf Channel how many rounds were in excess of 5 1/2 hours. A few players mentioned to him they thought 'sports psychologists' were at least part of the problem. Some players are taught a long pre-shot routine and are also taught to back off the shot if they are not 100% ready to perfectly execute the shot. That's fine, but not 4 1/2 minutes worth of it.
Good piece, John, but the Tour is not listening. Everyone player on Tour, the caddies, the TV crew and every Tour official from Finchem on down know the offenders.
Obviously, the PGA Tour does not genuinely care. If they did, they would take 37 seconds and implement the following:
First time out of position on course - one stroke penalty
Second time - two strokes
Third time - two tournament penalty
Penalty would apply to everyone in group. There would be no appeal process and no instant replay.
For many decades, the solution was right in front of their face. They saw it. They just do not have the gumption to pull the trigger and implement it.
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It's about time Feinstein caught up...
…I know I’ve been railing on this sports psycobabbler addiction golfers have had for at least 10 years. (then again, it’s Feinesten and I don’t expect much from him)
Can’t agree with you on penalizing the whole group. If your penalty system had been in place a couple of years ago, the greatest slow play protest in golf history would have cost Rory Sabbatini a penalty while playing with Ben Crane.
The Tour has a decent system – it’s just gathering dust in the Tour offices. The warnings and penalties are supposed to start at 61 seconds for the first player in the group, and 41 seconds for the second player, etc. That is more than enough time to figure out yardage, then pick a shot and a club, then play the shot.
There has to be a way to play a tournament, or get these guys together in the off season for a demonstration tournament so the Tour can explain how things are going to be, give it a try, and make adjustments if necessary. If they don’t show up for the demonstration rounds, then they are on their own and will face the penalties.
Then again, the players have veto power over Tour rules decisions…hmmm….
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
Slow play Sucks!!
One Eye…..I agree there needs to be stiff rules implemented and enforced to eliminate slow play…..may I suggest a few.
First Time out of Position -- Slow player to be Tasered for 20 seconds.
Second Time - Water Board the Offending Player.
Third and Last -- Shoot the sucker!!!
I guarantee play would speed up significantly!
The Saints ARE the SUPER BOWL CHAMPS....WHO DAT!
Or
Have Blair O’Neal play in the group ahead of you dressed in her bell hop outfit as shown in the fan post above this one. For sure you group will keep up the pace.
"pain is only weakness leaving the body"
Jumpin, does
your GF know you have this fixation for Blair?…and EM is right, as with looters, you can cure the problem right quick, just shoot the suckers…good thing we have a gun law here in the USA of Texas that would help….I can see it now…Instead of white belts the players would wear holsters and 6 guns…..ya gotta love it…..STUB..
4 hours for a 4 ball is enough..
Pros sometimes have crowd issues as you might see at St Andrews this year. There isn’t much room there for 30,000 people like there is at Turnberry for instance.
Easing my man...
I don’t think it has anything to do with spectators…It’s just slow play by the pros…while watching a telecast, or in person, take note of how many times they back off the shot…Getting ready, than feel a breeze…more consultation with the caddy,…checking of tree tops, etc….I used to watch when some of the older players were out there…it took maybe 10-12 seconds to pull the club and go…now, it’s not unusual for a minute or two to go by….add that all up, and you have a 5 hr. round of golf….Last time out, I played (loose use of the word here) behind some Asian gentlemen….I swear, each and everyone was playing for the US open….I finally called it quits after 9…took 3 hrs and my blood pressure must have gone up 100 points….I still say “shoot the suckers”…STUB
Stub.....Glad you signed on to my
“shoot the suckers” rule change. I would have put it first, but by using the Tasers and then Waterboarding, we would really tick off the ACLU and Obama, which increases our fun!
The Saints ARE the SUPER BOWL CHAMPS....WHO DAT!
Once played in a 5 and a half hour round...
it was torture. I agree pros take too long…but at St Andrews the sheer numbers of fans moving to and from the course can slow play up sometimes…6 hour rounds are common Thurs and Fri
Hell EM,
I’m all for fun at their expense….I was watching TV of the problems they are having getting aid to the people after the disasters….There were many comments about the looters and rioters….As I watched this, my mind said…."stop the problem….shoot a few, and the rest will fall in line..sorry,.I really do believe this…..STUB
Stub......
I remember after Katrina the media crying about the poor folks in N.O. and how they were looting just so they could eat…..then they showed a scene on Canal Street and the thugs coming out of the stores with a laptop appetizer, a flat screen entree, and a blue ray player for dessert…….I was wondering how they would get a fork into their “food”, but those guys are really resourceful…..lol. I’m with ya…..shoot ’em!
The Saints ARE the SUPER BOWL CHAMPS....WHO DAT!
I don't
have huge problem with pros taking their time as long as it’s semi reasonable. They’re playing for a lot of money and it’s their profession. What I have a problem with is Joe 30 handicapper in the group in front doing it and acting like he’s playing for a Masters title.
Fight for your opinions, but do not believe that they contain the whole truth, or the only truth.
Charles A. Dana
slow play on tour......
Who here is on tour? Could it be a telecast problem? Slow play on tour has no effect on me except the telecast may run over a bit. The tour has rules in place, they just must enforce them vigorously. Slow play in the group in front of me does indeed suck, but i just take it for what it is. I can get in a few more practice swings, and prepare for my shot. If the Marshal’s don’t get on the offenders, then the course loses money. On tour there are slow players, but if it costs them cash, i assure you they will……..speed up.
"The game is swell when it's played well."
by Fairways and Grins on Mar 6, 2010 2:06 PM EST up reply actions
I don't agree with penalyzing all the players in a group
If one player is slowing the group up, it isn’t the fault of the other two. They shouldn’t get penalyzed for it. After all they don’t have a choice of who they play with, only the scores they shoot and at times tournament officials can decide that, not the players themselves.
The thing we don't see on TV...
…is how fast these guys move from shot to ball. All we see on TV are these guys at their balls going through all their gyrations that seem like they are taking forever. Nicklaus would walk very quickly from shot to ball so he would have as much time as possible to get himself set for the next shot.
Today’s play (Saturday) finished at least 15 minutes ahead of schedule…which should also be against the rules because it leaves Jimmy Roberts time to ask such insightful questions to Villegas as, “how important is putting to your game ?” (wouldn’t you have loved it if Villegas had given him a “that’s the dumbest question I have ever heard” expression, followed by an answer like, “I can take it or leave it”, then walked off ?)
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
TV rules........
“We want to get it in on time” That’s what this is all about. Sometimes the last group…….On sunday is out of position. They’re not holding anbody up, and Millions are at stake. Nerves are frazzled, and decisions are monumental. So here comes “da marshal” aka. the official. “Um guys you’re out of position” what he’s not saying is we’re up against it. 60 minutes starts in less than half an hour, and the Prez of the network has made some calls. Sure slow play is a problem, but sometimes the motives of the enforcers is questionable. Doesn’t happen that often, but at times it does.
"The game is swell when it's played well."
by Fairways and Grins on Mar 6, 2010 11:01 PM EST reply actions
So the last group is out of position – one hole behind. Player A in the penultimate group is putting to stay tied with player B in the last group. Player B, is hanging back waiting to see if he needs to make par for a playoff or birdie to win. Is player B not getting an advantage by being out of position and knowing what he needs to do? It often happens that it’s down to the last two groups.
Play it as it lies
motives of the enforcers ? These aren’t network executives – they are golf rules officials. They know where players are supposed to be based on their tee time, and they adjust for problems ahead. (searching for balls…penalty shots requiring returning to the previous position, etc etc etc)
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
The last 2 groups often have the biggest crowds around.
That adds to delays, getting them quiet, etc.
Doesn't the last group
Always know what they have to do anyway. Being in position is a bigger advantage, because they can see exactly what the penultimate group has done. I still believe the TV Tower has more control over things than most, but that’s just my opinion from watchiing sports in general. Player B always has to wait and see what Player A does. That’s why he’s in the final group. His advantage is being in the final group. The rules are not being enforced by the officials throughout the year, thus the problem in general. If you don’t enforce them on Thursday, then you certainly shouldn’t be pushing the matter on Sunday…..60 minutes or not 60 minutes.
"The game is swell when it's played well."
by Fairways and Grins on Mar 7, 2010 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
theoretically yes, but...
…not always – there aren’t scoreboards on every hole
The TV tower has no control over anything outside of what is going out over the airways. They have DVR’s to record shots to replay when coming out of a break – but they can’t control pace of play.
They DO have influence on tee times to the extent that they know generally how long a round should take and what time they should be able to finish and get off the air for the news or other programming…but this is sports and things don’t always go the way they want.
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
I don't see that much
problem with the pros, other than a few of the obvious ones, the problem is, the viewers, et al the real golf fans…They see all this on TV and the next thing you know, they are doing the same thing on the course…have 3-4-5 groups do this, and watch how fast the whole course backs up, Marshal’s or no….Handicap players tend to mimic what they see on TV..As well as buy equipment the pros use…when they should be taking lessons to get better at shot making….When I was a kid and just starting to loop, the caddy master did a 7 day school to TRAIN US on bag placement, flag holding, etc…then we were given 1 week, and if some members didn’t request us, it was down the road…I could carry doubles, and get my guys/ladies around in under 4 hours….STUB
Agreed Stub
if I ever play with someone who is inexperianced at the game, I stress the importance of speed of play…I think seasoned players have this responsibilty to the game.
I go back and forth. On one hand, I can't stand
being rushed but on the other, I am a quick player. I line up my process, get over the ball, and go on.
I can’t stand others who take 5 minutes to shoot a pathetic shot.
The really bad players dont need to take an hour to put together a shot EVERYONE knows is going to be bad
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