Tiger Woods: The Competition Will Determine His Place In History
The competition determines a champion. It also determines the greatness of a champion. What would Larry be without Magic, Ali be without Frazier, and the Yankees be without the Red Sox, just to name a few. While certainly not his fault, Tiger has no Magic, Frazier, or Red Sox.
A recent study by a college student showed that pro golfers shot higher scores when Tiger Woods was in the tournament than when Tiger was not in the tournament. If this isn’t the definition of choking, I don't know what is.
This study should come as no surprise to anyone who regularly watches the PGA tour. Nearly every weekend when Tiger is in the hunt, the golfers ahead of him give away strokes faster than a massage therapist during a happy ending. Most of the time we watch golfers well in control, gradually give away strokes until Tiger, who looked like he was out of the tournament, finds himself in the lead. Many times Tiger is shooting a poor or very average round. It’s the other golfers who come back to him.
It’s almost a foregone conclusion that Tiger is never out of the tournament – not only because Tiger shoots himself back in to the tournament after a poor round or two, but more often because the other golfers shoot themselves out of the tournament.
As a real golf fan, it’s discouraging to see such a lack of competition. We long for a challenge to Tiger. Golf could be so much more exciting. How good would it be for the fans and the game of golf for some other golfer to stare down Tiger, gut it out, and win?
Golf is in serious need of some men with balls. We need a real man to step up, handle his nerves, and play up to his potential. We need a man who can do that consistently. Right now, there are no real men in golf.
read more here. http://www.realmanmag.com/tigerwoodsbestgolferever.html
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a STUDY ??
I sure hope that no tax dollars went to those college students for that “study”. Maybe it was a class in obvious statistical analysis (possibly taught by Johnny Miller ?).
However, I’m not willing to accept those findings as a definition of choking. If you accept that definition, you have to take it back to the days of Palmer and Nicklaus. When Arnie’s Army was on the march, or The Golden Bear was making a charge, there were some great champions that just plain got run over.
Great players have an affect on a field that “mere mortal” golfers just don’t have. The great ones are a mental distraction to regular players – and distractions are things they can’t afford when taking on the best in the world. Then they start thinking that they have to do things they either aren’t capable of, or haven’t prepared to do – then mistakes start to happen. That’s not choking
Choking is when you just can’t do the things you normally do. Laying the sod over a wedge from 100 yards – missing a 2 foot putt – leaving a lag putt 10 feet short – that’s choking.
You couldn’t be more right about the Tour needing a few players to grow a pair. Unfortunately, Tiger has done such a thorough job of destroying hopes of most Tour veterans, it’s going to take someone like an Anthony Kim, or more likely some guys who haven’t even made it to the Tour yet – guys who built their own games watching Tiger, not watched their games get destroyed by Woods’ relentless pressure.
Phil Mickelson has pretty much admitted that the game belongs to Tiger and he doesn’t have anything to beat Woods. No pair there.
Rocco Mediate has a pair – but he is pretty much past his prime, and his attitude was “let’s have some fun and see how we do,” not “I’m going to show that Woods guy that I mean business and he’s holding my place at the top.”
I see Anthony Kim as the tip of the iceberg – the challengers to Tiger’s throne are coming, but they aren’t here just yet.
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
by courtgolf on Jul 7, 2008 11:15 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
the study
Is a study in ridiculousness, and the reaction to it posted by “RealMan” is a study in misinterpreting statistics. Other golfers’ scoring averages are higher in tourneys Tiger plays because Tiger only plays the best tourneys, on the toughest courses!
As for these comparisons between the number of majors Jack’s competitors won and Tiger’s competitors won: Again, ridiculous, because you’re comparing Jack’s full career (and the completed, finished numbers of his competitors) to only half a career – if that – worth of data from Tiger and his competitors.
But more importantly, Jack’s competitors weren’t just the top 7 or 8 guys in the field, and Tiger’s aren’t the top 7 or 8 in the field. Their competitors are the entire field every week. Which tournament is harder to win – a tourney with Jack plus Player, Palmer, Casper, Trevino, and Floyd only, or a tournament with Jack, Player, Palmer, Casper, Trevino, Floyd and 150 other guys? The full-field, by a longshot.
What matters is that from top to bottom, the fields on the PGA Tour in 2008 are exponentially deeper than they were in 1968. It is MUCH harder to win on the PGA Tour in 2008 than it was in 1968. And the fact that Jack’s TOP competitors won more majors relative to Tiger’s (at least so far) bears that out. It’s exactly what you’d expect to see on a Tour whose talent thinned out considerably as you moved farther away from the top dog.
by Mulligan Stu on Jul 8, 2008 9:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
comparative statistics 101
A college freshman writes a C+ paper that gets cited on the Web. CG freaks out (again) at the thought of government funding a study (note: if the student in question is attending college on the GI Bill, it probably is). Forget those, let’s take a look at a couple of Tiger’s real contributions to tour golf.
- Remember back in the old days when tour players looked like John Daly? Tiger has shown his peers that a rigorous conditioning program pays benefits in scoring. The result is that tour players emulate Tiger, the tour as a whole has gotten better and only John Daly looks like John Daly. How many years in a row has the media voted Tiger the “Male Athlete of the Year?” For a golfer???
- If his peers honestly answered the question: “What has been Tiger’s biggest contribution to the Tour?” most would say the crowds, television audience and tournament purses have all grown exponentially since Tiger joined the tour. Do you think Zach Johnson would have the same effect?
Admittedly, Tiger charging from behind on Sunday to win a major is as rare as someone who calls himself “real man” actually being one, but his effect is much more than just taking home a trophy. Personally, I love when Tiger’s drive misses the fairway because it’s so much fun watching his recovery shot from behind a row of trees. That’s what Tiger is all about.
by dianemarie on Jul 8, 2008 10:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I know who to ask for money now
D – I am going to come to you for money when I have some hair-brained idea. Taxpayer dollars are not intended for idiotic “studies” like that – but our lovely gub-mint hands out our hard earned dollars like water to these people. I did not “freak out” – but I’m not surprised that you would come out with a phrase like that. BUT – students like that would truly love your grading scale if you call that a “C+” paper.
- Getting in shape has nothing to do with getting the ball in the hole. If being in shape was what it took to hit the ball a long way – John Daly wouldn’t even be in the conversation, much less have two majors. Tiger’s physical conditioning helps him hit the ball farther, helps him get out of ridiculously impossible trouble, and helps him keep up his level of play over a longer stretch (if you can call working 16-20 weeks out of 52 a stretch of work) than if he was out of shape. Unfortunately, a lot of golfers on tour think that getting in the gym is the answer to the holes in thier game – not improving their skills and mental game. They substitute physical conditioning and psycho-babble hocus pocus for good course management and imagination. Oh – Tiger has 18 ESPY’s, but has never been voted Male Athlete of the Year twice in a row – Golfer of the year…Player of the year – just about every year – but not Male Athlete of the Year.
- his peers would say THE MONEY. The rest of the PGA Tour would play in the middle of the Sahara Desert with camels for caddies to make the money they make. the crowds and TV attention are a distant second to the money.
- Tiger has NEVER come from behind to win at a major – it’s not rare – it’s non-existant (to this point in his career). I’m glad you like watching Tiger make great shots from trouble – we all do – but style points are not what he’s all about. His AFFECT definitely goes beyond his trophy case – more people watch and play, and the Tour guys are loving the money (the LPGA women have benefitted, too) – but Tiger is about winning. Period. The money is a biproduct. If he made the great shots, but didn’t win – he would just be in the field – not the greatest player ever. If he didn’t have the studly good looks and glow in the dark smile – he wouldn’t be rolling in endorsement dollars.
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
by courtgolf on Jul 8, 2008 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
interesting
CG, many of your points are valid, however I need to respond to a few.
- My understanding is that grading in college these “everyone gets a trophy whether you earned it or not” days has been seriously inflated so that what would have rated a C in my day routinely gets an A now. Given that, a C+ today is really substandard work.
- I’ll have to get out my copy of the federal budget to verify this, but I think some government studies are actually worth the tax dollars spent on them. Some are not. But if you’re looking for mis-spent money, you might try Dick and George’s buddies at the Oil Behemoths who are still getting tax breaks despite raking in record profits and at the same time, hoarding oceans of oil so they keep the price high.
- Tiger has NEVER come from behind to win a major if you don’t count the 2008 US Open.
- Finally, Tiger raised the bar so that his peers feel the need to copy him in order to be competitive, whether it’s time on the range or time in the gym. But no matter how else you classify golf at that level, it’s entertainment. As long as ‘we the public’ are willing to spend time watching commercials between golf shots and buy what Tour players endorse, sponsors and networks and tournament hosts and whoever else is involved, will be willing to put up obscene amounts of cash. You can’t blame the players for doing what they can to grab it.
I didn’t mean to offend you with the “freak out” comment. You have your views on government and I have mine. I suspect we’ll butt heads again and still be friends.
by dianemarie on Jul 8, 2008 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ok ok
apology accepted – but no – Tiger didn’t come from behind to win the US Open – he had the lead after the third round.
and we sure do agree on grading these days – it seems like kids today have to get a masters degree to get the same education we got through high school ! :-D
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
by courtgolf on Jul 8, 2008 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"talent"
Stu – here’s a thought for you to mull and comment on…
Talent isn’t just a physical attribute.
There is no argument that todays athletes are physically superior to any generation past. They combine nutrition and training better than ever. They have coaching with all kinds of scientific methods and technology to monitor progress and to help athletes fix problems and improve.
The problem I see is that these modern athletes seem to want their physical abilities to carry them to championships, but they ignore the things that make a champion what they are – intelligence and heart, and sometimes a little desperation thrown in for good measure.
In the last week or so, I have heard commentators talk about how great tennis player Andy Roddick is. He’s a terrific talent, but all he ever had was an intimidating serve. When everybody figured it out – he faded…fast. Physically talented – but very little between the ears. Andre Agassi was the same way for the first part of his career. Ivan Lendl called him “a forehand and a haircut”. He was quick and had amazing hand-eye coordination, but was as dumb as a box of rocks. If he couldn’t overpower his opponent, he lost. (that part of his career was courtesy of Nick Bolletierri, who teaches “hard and harder” tennis) Then Brad Gilbert came along and taught him how to play the game – how to construct points and beat the top players.
This past weekend, the Atlanta Braves outfielders made bad throw after bad throw from the outfield. All physically talented athletes – but they don’t work at their craft. The announcer told stories of players in his day who would make throws to all bases EVERY day so that when a throw was needed – they were ready. We have had to put up with Andrew Jones and Jeff Franceour here in the outfield. Jones is defensively the greatest center fielder I have ever seen – but he is absolutely clueless at the plate. Listen to his at bats for the Dodgers, where he was traded this past season – he is boo’d mercilessly because of his inability to hit. He and Francouer are monsters when pitchers throw fastballs over the plate – but breaking pitches make them look like little leaguers.
College basketball and football players are given millions of dollars on draft days – more than most of the rest of their teammates who have been in the league for years. They have great college talent – then decide that they know it all and never work to improve to play with the pros – but they have “their money”. (a phrase that drives me nuts)
Professional golf, at least men’s professional golf, is drowning in cash. Too many guys just see a comfortable living and don’t bother with thoughts of winning. (last year, there were 34 players who topped the $2 million mark – 99 made over $1 million – #125 on the money list topped $785,000) Thankfully, Tiger earns his portion. Mickelson has folded up his tent and is playing for the cash – and has all but admitted so. He knows he can’t beat Tiger, so he just floats along waiting for a week when his game just falls into place. (he works at his game – and he over-analyzes everything better than any player in history – but he has no heart to battle with Tiger)
THE most talented golfer on the planet is a drunk. John Daly traded his heart for a bottle. The guy with more shot making ability than anyone in the game hits his driver about 230, but he finds ways to make pars and birdies – Corey Pavin just doesn’t have the youth, size, or strength to play today’s courses consistently.
Tiger has sucked the life out of just about all of the potential competition. He may lose a battle here and there, but he always wins the war.
The list that always comes up when talking about players in Nicklaus’ day is made up of guys who didn’t give up and were willing to stand up to Nicklaus and go toe to toe. They had the heart to take on the big kid on the block and risk taking a beating. And if they got beat up – they got up and got ready for the next battle. They learned all kinds of shots and prepared for another shot at Nicklaus – and when they got up, they still had to keep going because Nicklaus would always do his best to come back. Those guys knew how to play the game – they understood their swings – they kept adding information to their memory banks.
Who makes up today’s list ? An aging Vijay Singh, a timid and damaged Ernie Els, and a heartless Phil Mickelson. Davis Love III and Fred Couples are aging AND damaged. Jim Furyk has the grit to compete, but he seems to be sapped of his strength the last year or so. Mike Weir and Trevor Immelman have game, but lack the size and length to compete week in and week out. Kenny Perry seems to have heart, but he’s getting old and is skipping two of this year’s four majors. Adam Scott has Tiger’s old swing, but not his heart and brain. If everything falls into place on a given week – he has a shot at beating Tiger (the WGC-CA Championship) – but that doesn’t happen very often. Sergio Garcia is supremely talented, but doesn’t have the heart. He seems to want to win without effort. (wouldn’t it be nice to have Sevi’s heart and imagination in Sergio’s body ?)
Yes – a majority of the fields in those days were the same as today – just doing their best to earn a living, but the list of guys with the guts and desire to take on the best – as well as the ability to beat him (physically and mentally) – was a lot deeper then than it is today. When Nicklaus was not in a field, you could count on these other guys to be around to battle it out. Today, when Tiger’s not in the field, it’s a crap shoot. We see more battles of attrition, with players backing up on Sunday, than exciting runs from behind like we saw from Anthony Kim last week.
SO – I submit that, while today’s fields are deeper with physical talent, the fields back in the days of Palmer and Nicklaus were much deeper with guys who had the physical game of the day, plus the heart, desire, and intelligence to challenge the big names of the day…and succeed.
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
by courtgolf on Jul 8, 2008 10:37 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
bad news, good news
The bad news is – the argument that “these guys playing today don’t have the desire or intelligence for the game like the old guys did” is older than Wrigley Field. Retired baseball players in Ty Cobb’s day were saying the same stuff with no more evidence to prove it than you just gave, Court. And if the money glut is actually the cause, it’s only because our entertainment-based society made it so and who are we to curse the result?
The good news? I’ve found a couple of sports where I have yet to see any evidence of such “timid, lazy, stupid” play, although the players have been accused of having no short game skills in one and not being able to dunk in the other. If you can get past those flaws, you might enjoy them too.
by hound dog on Jul 8, 2008 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ssoooooo.....
...because an argument has been around a long time makes it a bad argument ? I’d say that the results are pretty good evidence of the validity of the argument, plus statements by some of the players themselves.
Hmm – let me guess – LPGA and WNBA ? We both like the LPGA – but I’m not too big on the Welfare NBA. I’m glad the women have the league, but it’s not my cup of tea.
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
by courtgolf on Jul 8, 2008 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Competition determines a champion's place in history.
The point of the article is a simple one: competition determines a champion’s place in history. Not just in golf, but in any sport. I’m concluding that many don’t believe that hypothesis, based on their comments. Did Magic and Larry help improve their legends? How about Ali and frazier? and on and on. Certainly Nicklaus is held in higher esteem because of some the matches he played against top challengers.
I’d also guess that Tiger would be the first one to admit it. He loves competition and would love to compete against an Arnold Palmer, Gary Player, Tom Watson, etc. just as Nicklaus did. Granted, Tiger does not need any more competion in order to secure his place in golf history. However, if he had more competion, similar to that of Nicklaus, 50 years from now historians would surely put him on a much higher pedestal.
Regarding my name, it’s what I was born with. My apologies if it makes some feel a bit insecure. I’ve found developing a sense of humor helps that affliction.
http://www.realmanmag.com
The college student is an MBA candidate from Berekely.
Cheers!
by Real Man on Jul 10, 2008 3:53 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
no kidding ?
Apparently they left that amazingly obvious point out of the article. Those are points that might be allowed to pass in a low level high school class, but if it wasn’t tossed into the waste basket by a college professor – the professor needs to be investigated.
If that kid is an MBA student – from Berkely no less – Berkely has fallen on hard times.
By the way – I checked out realmanmag.com – pretty cool site.
Your name ? Real Man is your real name ? How cool is that ?
"this ball will fit in that fairway"
by courtgolf on Jul 10, 2008 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

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